Geert Wilders’ Fitna the Movie – 15 Minutes You Need to Spend (UPDATE: LiveLeak Forced by Threat to Take Down the Video. Google Video has It)
This is perhaps the most important and timely thing I have ever posted on The Sundries Shack. Geert Wilders has made a film. It’s only 15 minutes long but it is packed with wrenching images and speech that is, quite honestly, very hard to watch.
But we must watch it.
Islamism is a very real and present danger to all of us. And when I say Islamism, I do not mean “Islamist extremists” because the views voiced by the Muslims in this film are not held by a slender minority but by large numbers of Muslims. Islamism is fast becoming the Muslim belief and its increase grows faster every day.
We are in a fight for our lives and the lives of the generations that will follow after us. Wilders makes that very apparent using little more than the words of Islamists themselves and the images of their victims: men, women, and children whose only crimes were that they were not Muslim. We need to take this seriously. We need to set aside the infantile posturing, the moral weaseling, and the petty selfishness that we’ve displayed in the past six years. We need to stop playing games and start taking the Islamists as seriously as they take themselves.
And we need to do it now.
UPDATE (3/27 at 1836 Eastern): LiveLeak has been forced to take down the video due to craven threats to staff and the inability of authorities to do a darned thing to protect free speech. I can’t blame the folks at LiveLeak even a little. They did as much as they could.
For the present, you can see the video here, on Google Video.
It is still a joke, folks? Is it starting to sink in yet?
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Category: Featured, Fighting the Islamists
Powerful! I'm sure it will be well received at Cannes this year or, Denver…end sarcasm.
I have a difficult time watching something like this, but, I got through the whole thing, will definately be in my thoughts for quite some time.
Now, I intend to spread this around if you don't mind. Thanks Jimmy.
Fitna is now online, thanks to LiveLeak…
Well now, isn’t that fortunate that Geert Wilders has found a prominent video host willing to take up on his need for server space for Fitna. Go over to Hot Air to see…
[...] on this story: Michelle Malkin, Tel-Chai Nation, Wake Up America, Webloggin, Riehl World View, The Sundries Shack, A Blog for All, Fullosseous [...]
I found it quite dull, actually. It would be interesting if I didn't know that radical Muslims existed. But I found nothing new.
I agree with Joe R. What a let-down; there was nothing in the film I'd not seen before.
A clear statement of Wilders.
Politicians goes movies! Why not?
Although Fitna is too black-white for me, I find it pretty brave of Wilders to express his fear by making a movie.
Hopefully more people will learn from that.
Please show me your what you're concern about, show me your fear, so we can talk about it….
Making films, books, songs, debates etc. takes much more effort than making threads or just being senseless about everything.
Freedom of thinking is our most precious treasure.
We must cherish that and never give up.
[...] on this story: Michelle Malkin, Tel-Chai Nation, Wake Up America, Webloggin, Riehl World View, The Sundries Shack, A Blog for All, Fullosseous Flap.” There’s more via SDA, and comments ensue; more via [...]
As an iranian I would like to thank him for making this movie and I am hoping that one day I can get my country back. Don't let what happened to Persian to happen to the west too. One of the first places that arabs attacked was Persia in the 600's ad and practically destroyed our culture
JoeR and Lee…
If you're already aware of the problems with islam, then you're right – the film could be boring(well, boring isn't exactly the term I'd use). However the real story here isn't the film – it's about the dhimmitude. In case you don't know what that is, it's submission to islam. LiveLeak was forced by terrorist threats to take down the film. Comcast as well.
http://theneinblog.blogspot.com/2008/03/geert-wil…
Do we have freedome of speech or not? If movies such as this cannot be shown, we do not. _That's_ the story, not the film itself.
If you think that's violent, read the Book of Joshua. A clearer endorsement of genocide cannot be found. And when we look at history, it's clear that the Christians took the message of genocide to heart. Here in America, the Christian colonists not only acted out the message, but upscaled it Cecil B. DeMille style.
Before Mr. Wilders asks Muslims to tear out the offending passages of the Quran, he should tear the Book of Joshua out of his Bible. And he shouldn't stop there. The Book of Revelations is even worse (and considered to be a war plan by many Christians, most notably John Hagee). And there are passages in Exodus (also repeated in the Quran)that really should go too, like the actions of the Sons of Levi, which are an obvious endorsement of genocide against Hindus.
Look, if the Muslims had any real power, I might be worried, but they don't. The Christians have long been the dominant military force on the planet. Just look at a map of the world in 1916. The Christians controlled the entire world except for Japan, Thailand, Iran, and Turkey (Ottoman Empire, sort of). Their domination was very nearly complete. And these people want to recreate the story of the Book of Revelations.
I'm neither a Christian (who'd have guessed?) or a Muslim. And the Muslims have always treated my religion far worse than they ever treated the Christians (unless you consider higher taxes to be a fate worse than death, which those of my religion received). So I have every reason to be concerned about Islam. But the Book of Revelations promises me an equally horrible fate, and those who believe it are far more powerful and dangerous than the Muslims will ever be.
This is why McCain's desire to have John Hagee's endorsement bothers me so much. He could be given the military might to carry out the Book of Revelations and seems to agree with Hagee that it should be carried out.
I few months ago, I saw the most powerful speech of my life. It was the Dalai Lama's warm-up act for the dedication of the new Loseling Drepung Monastery in Mundgod, India. And it was given by the Hindu guru Sri Sri Rav Shankar. The speech was about the need to confron religious extremism and 'communalism' everywhere it exists and regardless of which religion it comes from. It was made all the more powerful by the Dalai Lama's presence behind him. The religions of the world can come together. But it won't happen until we confront the extremists within our own ranks. Surely Islam needs to do this, but Christianity needs to do it as well. Even my religion, Buddhism, needs to do it, as evidenced by the appalling behavior of some of the rioters in Lhasa. To his credit, the Dalai Lama did condemn the violence, just as Sri Sri Ravi Shankar condemns the violence committed against Muslims by his fellow Hindus. Unfortunately, the Abrahamic religions seem caught up in Old Testament hatred, which blinds them to their misdeeds.
"the new Loseling Drepung Monastery"
Oops, the standard English usage is "Drepung Loseling". I used the order of words that my Tibetan friends use. My bad.
And sorry for the spelling errors. I'm an engineer, not a linguist.
Tom, I'm sorry but that's bunk. There is no Christian denomination that is even remotely close to mainstream preaching that its followers destroy any people, anywhere based on any book of the Old Testament. IN fact, I'm not sure you can find any religion at all.
I still have no idea what genocide you believe Hagee is preaching. I've not seen him call for Christians to destroy any race of nationality or even to destroy the unbelievers. I don't believe that you've read the Book of Revelations correctly if you think that it is any sort of war plan. Indeed, it is seen as a book of prophesy – what will come regardless of what we Christians do or don't do. It is seen as an inevitability, not something we Christians can bring about or prevent.
Well said, fostert.
In fact, Jimmie, the Domminionists ARE a sect of Christianity that is directly comparable to the Islamists. They don't have cells, because they have the air force, at present. If left unchecked, they will have the entire US military. Thier plan, if you google domminionists, is to spread Christianity around the world using the US miliary. They harass non-evangelical Christians in the military to the point where thousands are filing complaints, including those on active duty in Iraq. I would concurr with fostert that they use the Book of Revelation as a war plan.
The more I look at types like John Hagee, the more I begin to think that these southern extremist evangelical baptists fit the description of the anti-christ – they pursue power blindly, they believe in the use of military force as an offensive weapon (not just defensive), and they are obsessed with money – all values which are anti-christian in the extreme.
On Geert Wilders film – he definately did not tell the world anything it didn't already know – it is pure shock and horror fodder. The next european holocost will be the muslims – it is quite obvious to anyone who knows european history. Geert'a goal is not to whip up the good ole boys to go after terrorists – the world is already doing that. His goal is to whip up the masses against the ordinary muslims in europe. This film is just a part of the "dehumanize the enemy" phase – then europe will take out its detailed, well versed ethnic cleansing manual and begin "the purge" of all non-whites. Yawn – can't europe come up with a new cycle of events?
donna – Dominionists? Really? Chris Hedges was full of crap when he wrote about them and most other folks who have since then have no idea what on earth they're talking about. I've seen more than a couple articles and none of them are written with a good-faith effort to even begin to understand the theology of the Bible. I"m sorry. If that's what you have, you can't be taken seriously.
As for Wilders, you couldn't be more wrong. Muslims won't be the victim of genocide in Europe because of one simple thing – demographic trends. Muslims will soon be the majority ethnic group in most European countries. And I'm not willing to let the "ordinary Muslims" off the hook. I've linked to several polls here on this blog that show that the Islamist way of thinking is far from on the fringes of Muslim belief. We're talking poll numbers in the high 30s and 40s here.
I'll bet you that there are more Muslims who believe that homosexuals should be put to death than there are Christians who believe the same thing.
You seem to be oblivious the the colonial imperialism that occurred from 1492 to 1942. And I'm giving you a break by saying it ended with the independence of India. It went on well beyond that, and into my personal memory. And you seem to neglect that 90% of the natives in America were 'eliminated'. And that you, personally, live on that stolen territory. I admit it, and I feel bad about it. But you seem to think that it's all fine and dandy. And I know that my Christian ancestors committed horrible acts to get that territory.
This is no joke or fantasy. My ancestors came to this land in the 1720's. My mother was a member of the Daughters of the American Revolution, which can only be accomplished by proving that your ancestors fought to create this country (I still have the gun). To do this, she had to look into our records, which clearly documented which land we stole from the natives. I've seen those records. And my ancestors killed those people to steal their land. And their Christian identity did absolutely nothing to stop them from doing it. In fact, it only encouraged them. Would Jesus have done that? I think not. But his followers most certainly did, and kept records to prove it. And the very property you live on has similar records (I know you're from Maryland). Now I suspect that you're one of those "new Americans" whose ancestors came after the genocide on the East Coast (and before the Revolution), but you're still living on stolen land. And while there were a few Jews who stole the land as well, not a single Muslim was involved at that time. They didn't reach here until the 1800's (probably before your ancestors). And the 'Manifest Destiny' ideology that moved on from there was clearly steeped in Christian ideology. Don't believe it? Where you live, there are libraries that have old newspapers that go back to that time. Learn to read microfiche, and check the editorials from those days. If you're not shocked, you're either a racist or a Christian Dominionist (not that there's a difference).
And don't even get me started about what happened in South America or Africa or Asia. Your blindness to to misdeeds of Christians is obvious. I'd like to think that that blindness isn't caused by hatred. Please reassure me that you are only misinformed and not a bigot.
Now you might say that just because a Christian commits genocide doesn't mean that Christianity endorses it (although it obviously did during WWII, and Pope John Paul II had to apologize for it). But doesn't Islam deserve the same the same treatment? You want to say that Christianity has nothing to do with actions of Christians (which kind of says that your religion has no meaning). But you also want to say that any act of any Muslim is an act of ALL Muslims. How is not that not an egregious double standard?
As for Hagee, will you please just listen to even ONE of his sermons? Every one of them is filled with references of to the Book of Revelations. And that book says that everyone who isn't a Christian (like me) will DIE. Obviously, the book was not intended to be taken literally. It was a metaphorical diatribe against Rome (with good justification, I'll add). But that's clearly not how Hagee sees it. He not only takes it literally, he lobbies our government to ensure it will happen. On this point, I'm okay with Bush, because he was just using Hagee to gain political power. And he never sought out Hagee's endorsement. But McCain did. He needs to say it was merely manipulation of the Dominionist masses and not a real threat.
In the end, why is it that a neutral party like me in the conflict between Islam and Christianity has such a negative view of the actions of Christians? The media in this country is clearly pro-Christian and anti-Muslim. My education did nothing but tell me that Muslims were evil (in Pennsylvania, Christianity was heavily promoted in public schools and Islam was considered Devil worship). So how did my contact with both Christians and Muslims lead me to believe that the Christians are the more serious problem? Some of it has to do with the fact that I've been treated like crap by quite a lot of Christians and not a single Muslim has been anything less than beautifully hospitable to me. If you want to promote your religion, you should encourage your Christian brethren to start by treating me with respect. You, Jimmie, have been very honorable in this aspect, and I am very appreciative of that, but you are a both a credit and minority in your religion.
I was only a Christian for two years of my life. And those were the only two years that I never faced discrimination. And I can tell you, it is a lot easier now being a Buddhist that being an Atheist. But I'm still called a "Devil Worshiper" (or worse) on a pretty regular basis. Until your fellow Christians stop harassing me, or until you acknowledge that the are doing so, you will never convince me that Christianity is nothing but a religion that seeks to eliminate me and everyone like me. I've been in that Church and for now, I'd rather it didn't exist. As for Jesus, he was a great man and I very much respect his message. He was a great bodhisattva. It's too bad his followers won't listen to his message.
"The next european holocost will be the muslims – it is quite obvious to anyone who knows european history."
You know, we liberals like to think of the Europeans as perfect people. But we are wrong about that. They are among the most racist and xenophobic people on the planet. Only the Asians are worse. We in America, despite our obvious flaws, are actually pretty damn open minded when it comes to race. That's a new thing, obviously, but I convinced that we're committed to it.
But as much as we like to think of ourselves as religiously tolerant, we are every bit as bad as the Europeans, and much worse than the Asians (they are remarkably tolerant on religion now). So who are the Americans going to attack? The Athiests, of course.
As a Buddhist, I'm not really sure if I can qualify for being non-Atheist, but I'm really good at fooling Christians into believing I'm one of them when I need to. I spent two days (accidental I can assure you) in Turkey with Randall Terry, founder of Operation Rescue and the scariest person I've ever met (believe me, I've had many guns pointed at me, so that's saying a lot). He never suspected that I didn't fully agree with him, and he really opened up. His views were way more scary than the Wahhabi scholar from Syria I'd met the day before that. If you ever happen to see his footage from Ephesus or Pergamon, I'm the camera man. I'm a little ashamed of that, but you have play the part if you want to hear the real story. Short story: he's even crazier than Hagee. And his video footage proves it. I could barely stop from throwing the camera at him. And I'm a peaceful man.
Muslims the majority of Europe? Please, Jimmie, learn some math before you embarrass yourself even more. Turns out Europe has about 1 Muslim for every 6 Christians. Let's assume that nobody converts (because conversion from Christianity to Islam might indicate an inferiority for your religion) and, that between immigration and higher birth rates, that Muslims will reproduce at 3 times the rate of Christians (the 3 times is an accurate number for birth rates, and Christians far exceed Muslims in immigration, so I'm giving you another benefit here). How long will it take for Muslims to become the majority? I can calculate the answer for you but I won't. I want to see if you can actually do the math (or have friend who can). But I will give you a hint: all of us will be dead by that time. And that's assuming that immigration really won't have an effect. In truth, and despite the claims of European racists, most immigrants are Christian. And it turns out that immigrants are pretty much the only people in Europe having more than 2 kids these days, Christians included. The Muslim population will certainly increase on a percentage basis, but mathematically biased projections put the Muslim population at 25% 100 years from now. And the bias is a result of ignoring the birth rates of Christian immigrants. That bias works in your favor, but still refutes your argument. Europe may become more Muslim than India, but the Muslims surely won't take over. Now you may wonder why the stories you hear are so inaccurate. It's because you rely on resources that aren't fact-checked and are even more mathematically inaccurate than sources that admit a pro-Christian bias.
"As for Wilders, you couldn’t be more wrong. Muslims won’t be the victim of genocide in Europe because of one simple thing – demographic trends. Muslims will soon be the majority ethnic group in most European countries. And I’m not willing to let the “ordinary Muslims” off the hook. I’ve linked to several polls here on this blog that show that the Islamist way of thinking is far from on the fringes of Muslim belief. We’re talking poll numbers in the high 30s and 40s here. "
If numbers were what mattered in terms of domination, then we would already have been driven out of Iraq and Afghanistan and the Palestinians would have finished of the Isrealis a long time ago. When the Nazi holocost wiped out 12 million people in Europe, it wasn't because there were more Nazis than non-nazis. There are other factors at work.
As far as the polls are concerned – I don't take the results of "no-win" questions seriously. The question "Are you an American or a Muslim first" is a nonsensical question. I was imagining being asked if I was an American or a woman first, and I don't think I could answer – because I can't imagine what it is like to be a non-woman, or a non-american. Both are part of my identity. Or the question – are you an American or a heterosexual first? When asked to choose between factors which are equally part of oneself, I don't think the answer really tells us anything.
Again, msuslims have had a long time to slaughter chrisitans around the world, and they haven't done it. Yes, there is a problem with terrorism based on a twisted interpretation of some islamic principles, and if we can maintain our focus on the terrorists and not the muslim world at large, we will conquor them. If we lose our focus, we will not win.
Again, Geert Wilders has done nothing positive for the cause against terrorism – he is pushing for a war with all muslims.
donna
Dear all,
It is very shockingly amazing to hear and read about the contents of a movie by a Dutch parlimentarian, supposed to be a man with a great sense of responsibility which he is not.
I really feel very sorry for the voters who voted for such an idiot who rather than bridging the gap among the different cultures and religions is spreading hatred in the world by twisting the facts.
The fact should not be forgotten that Mr. Wilders is using rather misusing his position and the EU shoulder to fulfill his ill willed agendas to bring enemity between Muslims and Christians. What does he really want???
I would like to conclude on the yesterday's report by Vatican that Islam has outnumbered the others and have become the most observed religion of the world, may i ask why???
Do both things have any connection??
love and peace for all
ata – Did Wilders misquote the Koran? Perhaps he misquoted the Imams and killers?
No?
Well, what facts did he twist, exactly?
I watched Schism on youtube the Muslim answer to Fitna by Geert Wilders. Basically using the same idea taking quotes from the Bible out of context.
I reckon it's better than setting embassies on fire and killing one another accidently of course (something similiar to friendly fire but more condemnable of course as Brown people were doing it).
What I did find somewhat amusing was the Christian Evangelical responses to Schism. Death threats, vulgar and vile accussations, name calling, racist rants. Considerin I was always told the the followers of the Prince of Peace were very peaceful by nature.
So I questioned some one them. An error on my part. The more and more Evangelical right-wingers evoke the name of Jesus. The more and more I'm finding myself dispising Jesus.
The God who fell to Earth I see being worshipped by those who wish to leave Earth, very soon. But not without total ruin of the only place I was welcomed for arriving uninvited. I've begun to question why is it the followers of the Prince of Peace always tend to use the most brutal language? Could it be that whom they believe cannot offer them any inner peace?
Yes I know, it was rather mean and uncalled for, but it finally happened. It was bound to happen once especially since a follower of the Prince of Peace insisted that Jesus was God. The only conclusion I was left with is that he was a terrible novelist, Bible being his first attempt. That statement caused my banning at youtube for the third time. At the envouraging of those who wish if only Free Speech would reign as mightly in Islamic countries as it does from those who wished me banned, Muslims would be less violent.
Colonialization, Crusades, Inquisition, Sanctions would all be forgotten by Muslims if they could only speak freely and elect a goverment of their choice, well except in Algeria, Iran, Iraq, Syria, Lebanon, Egypt, Saudi Arabia and Palestine.